I have a couple of questions in regards to the JVDA vs. USAV:
1) Why does the JVDA get to use the USAV insurance on their teams and events when they boycotted USAV events?
2) Why do clubs get to be members of both organizations and reap the benifits from both?
3) Why were there two different "Championships Events" at the end of the season and why did the JVDA get to call it the JVDA Championships if they
are not a separate entity since they are using USAV insurance?(I am assuming the premise is correct in this question, if not, my apologies)
4) How does Niel Mason sit on the board of the JVDA, yet TCA participates in the USJOVCs? Is this a conflict? (This is not a slam on Niel, personally I like
Niel, just asking the question).
5) Is there a true National Champion for 2008?
PrepVolleyball.com
JVDA vs. USAV
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 KHitt71 |
JVDA vs. USAV |
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Posts: 18 (07/04/08 1:53 PM) |
Last Edited By: KHitt71 07/04/08 3:23 PM.
Edited 1 time.
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Star |
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Posts: 138 (07/04/08 2:14 PM) |
KHitt71 wrote:
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dick tracy |
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Posts: 80 (07/04/08 7:28 PM) |
I think it's safe to say that Sports Performance was the best 18-under team in the nation this year.
...but they weren't National Champions. That was TCA. JOs is still the national championship, IMO. It's really too bad we never got to see Austin 17s face off against KIVA, MAVA, or Illini Elite. |
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MB21 |
JVDA vs USAV | ||
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Registered Member
Posts: 53 (07/04/08 7:46 PM) |
JVDA stands for Junior Volleyball Directors Association...therefore, it is an organization of club leaders who came together to present their concerns to USAV....there was no "boycot".....being a member of USAV does not mean you are mandated to attend national qualifiers....their are lots of clubs who are members of USAV who NEVER go to qualifiers...each club decides individually which tournaments to attend and some prefer to attend end of the year events that don't require teams to qualify ie: Reno Volleyball Festival, Asics National Championship in Chicago etc....the JVDA teams chose not to participate in the qualifying process individually...there are JVDA member clubs who did go to qualifiers and Nationals...the JVDA Championship is a tournament at the end of the year that is sponsored by JVDA as an alternative for the clubs who CHOSE not to go to qualifiers, thus, Nationals ....simple |
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RIP THREAD |
Hmm... | ||
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Posts: 66 (07/04/08 9:23 PM) |
dick tracy wrote: ...it's not like AJ's 17s were hiding from them or anyone else...but I believe AJs would've taken care of business as they did as 16s against
these same teams.
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Mango |
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Posts: 556 (07/04/08 9:40 PM) |
RIP THREAD wrote: Do you get that from a reliable source or is that idle speculation about KIVA and Team Z running USAV National Qualifiers in the future?
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relativeyoungster |
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Posts: 878 (07/05/08 6:16 AM) |
There is NO WAY that both Team Z and KIVA get new qualifiers....they're too close together.
the rumour I'm hearing is that 2009 will have a KC qualifier, run by the heart of america region....not a club. |
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annadanna |
Definition of Boycott | ||
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Posts: 68 (07/05/08 7:30 AM) |
Why do some of you dislike the term "boycott" to describe the JVDA clubs' choices?
A boycott is the act of voluntarily abstaining from using, buying, or dealing with someone or some other organization as an expression of protest, to get that organization to change something. A boycott is also a collective effort in which some people, in an effort to get the organization to change their ways, convince other people to join with them in abstaining from using, buying, or dealing with that organization, to add more clout in the effort to effect change. According to that definition, the JVDA clubs organized a boycott, pure and simple. What's wrong with that? Why does anyone have a problem calling it what it is? I don't get it. A boycott is not a bad thing. |
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DaveBowman |
Not Boycott? | ||
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Posts: 73 (07/05/08 7:48 AM) |
IMO, many at the JVDA view this transition as the change from VHS to DVD. The world did not boycott VHS. The world just stopped buying an obsolete product.
As for speculation as to how the USAV 17's champ would fair against the JVDA 17's powers is just academic. But I will throw out there that the best 17's team in country is actually Muncie's 18's. They will be brutal to play next year. |
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VolleyDad9 |
Very funny | ||
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Posts: 1523 (07/05/08 7:55 AM) |
The world just stopped buying an obsolete product. 
Usually, while I frequently disagree with your comments, Dave, I usually respect them, but that analogy is so far off the mark it is laughable.
Fun? You mean Volleyball is supposed to be fun??
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annadanna |
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Posts: 68 (07/05/08 8:14 AM) |
DaveBowman wrote:Dave, are you suggesting that the JVDA did not try to get USAV to change anything? Then, that there was no organized effort via the JVDA to shun the qualifiers this year? And that no JVDA leaders have tried to get any other club to join with them and play at JVDA's rather than USAV's? Really? It's the "we want you to change" thing and the "organized effort" thing that makes it a true boycott, rather than just individual consumers deciding what's best to buy at the grocery store. Maybe to ask it another way, how exactly does this situation differ from a boycott? I mean, as I said before, to boycott something is not a bad thing.... |
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bluknight |
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Posts: 655 (07/05/08 8:37 AM) |
annadanna said, "
Maybe to ask it another way, how exactly does this situation differ from a boycott? I mean, as I said before, to boycott something is not a bad thing...." You're right, a boycott isn't a bad thing. But we associate it with negative situations and it has that connotation among people. Take your pick; the term was used during some turbulent and intense times in our history; American Civil Rights Movement, Olympics, Labor Disputes. |
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DaveBowman |
Analogy | ||
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Posts: 73 (07/05/08 8:52 AM) |
Laugh all you want. I thought that was a good analogy of their mindset. JVDA's product brochure toughts many of the same benefits that a new technology
is always billed up to be. Low cost, more options, better features, reducing CO emissions, etc. But many new technologies fall on their face such as digital
audio tape. But in this case the JVDA presents a process not a technology. I stand by my analogy.
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annadanna |
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Posts: 68 (07/05/08 8:56 AM) |
Okay, I've composed myself and I'm not laughing any more.
Dave, how does this differ from the definition of a boycott? It seems to have all of the essential ingredients of a boycott. |
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DaveBowman |
Capitulate | ||
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Posts: 73 (07/05/08 9:24 AM) |
Again IMO, I am not a JVDA mouthpiece and I do not know the current situation.
A boycotting party wants someone to capitulate. The JVDA has moved on. I do not think they care what the USAV does or does not do. That is why there is no boycott. |
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Mango |
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Posts: 556 (07/05/08 9:33 AM) |
It could also be viewed by some that it has already gone beyond the stage of trying to add more clout in the effort to effect change. As JVDA evolves
into a competitor for USAV, then it becomes an effort - struggle between both USAV and JVDA to get Clubs from the rival's Camp to change
affiliation - allegiance.
If that is the path that Jr. Volleyball is on, then it is closer to inducing Clubs to Vote with their Feet or Vote with their Dollars than performing a boycott. |
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VolleyDad9 |
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Posts: 1523 (07/05/08 9:33 AM) |
Low cost is rarely one of the touted benefits of new technology. I would say to this day that DVDs are still sold for the same or more than VHS tapes. Look at
the price of Blu-Ray DVDs in comparison to regular ones.
Additionally, when DVDs came out, they were touted as the replacement for VHS, not an alternative and I believe they were probably being developed by the same companies making VHS. And I don't believe anyone ever suggested that they should boycott VHS. As I wrote somewhere else recently, if the JVDA has things to offer that other clubs feel will benefit them and their players, I am pretty sure they will be there. Right now, outside of the midwest, I do not believe this to be the case.
Fun? You mean Volleyball is supposed to be fun??
Last Edited By: VolleyDad9
07/05/08 9:36 AM.
Edited 2 times.
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relativeyoungster |
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Posts: 878 (07/05/08 9:57 AM) |
DaveBowman wrote: I do think the JVDA still cares about what happens with USAV, from several points. 1) a lot of the heirarchy of the JVDA had been very associated with the USAV (Rich Z, Jenny Hahn) 2) USAV decisions directly affect the JVDA....since the JVDA uses USAV's insurance, and all of their tournaments are sanctioned by a regional office.... |
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wcalleallegre |
jdva vs usv | ||
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Registered Member
Posts: 80 (07/05/08 10:31 AM) |
I don't think JDVA saves that much money and the season is almost just as long which were the two bottom line arguments as I understand. With the rising
tournament fees, fuel and travel costs I propose doing away with the qualifier system for qualifying for JO and have a 128 team field National JO tournament.
Allocate 128 teams by regional membership with each region getting at least one team.....there are 48 regions.
The 128 team field could have a weeding out process for 1st day pool (6 0r 8 team pool) to determine 3 tiers (Open, Nat and Am or whatever you want to call it). It may be a 5 day tournament. Have those clubs that previously hosted qualifiers have their own (non sanction) tournaments. There will be plenty of nationwide tournaments during the season if clubs chooses to participate.. |
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olddblueeyes |
Hmm... | ||
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Posts: 84 (07/05/08 10:47 AM) |
...We like to travel; we don't want to play the same teams for nine-months; we want to be recruited. Address those elements in your proposal and
we're there as you will have built the better mousetrap! For teams other than the "We" there is Club Level ball..ENJOY!
The JVDA proposal gets a C for travel and facilities played in; D for playing the same teams; and B for recruitment...not bad for the first year. CAPITULATE..CA-PIT-U-LATE, Dave? Four syllable word on this site? You've obviously overestimated our collective IQs!  Can I get your phone number to text you the next time I'm in a
heated Scrabble game?
Last Edited By: olddblueeyes
07/05/08 10:56 AM.
Edited 2 times.
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annadanna |
Dave, I get your point, but... | ||
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Posts: 68 (07/05/08 10:58 AM) |
DaveBowman wrote:I understand what you're saying. However, the JVDA Objectives do not support your assertion that they have moved on, or that they don't care what the USAV does or doesn't do: JVDA Objectives: 1. To work to provide fair and democratic representation for Junior Volleyball clubs with... USA Volleyball (USAV) which is the national governing body of our sport. 3. To work with USA Volleyball to restructure the national championship qualification process so that it is more affordable and inclusive to all Junior Volleyball clubs who wish to participate. 4. To work with USA Volleyball to upgrade and professionalize the quality of the USAV Jr. National Championship tournament. Perhaps these objectives are outdated. Otherwise, we got ourselves a bonafide boycott! |
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